Sharp will extend colour display standard

"I tried swapping an LED for a light bulb and it went bang, but while it worked it wasn't as bright as the light bulb."

Yeah. I know what you mean, I tried swapping a lighbulb for a LED and it didn't shine very bright at all. Didn't explode though, maybe 3v dc didn't quite cut it. I wish there was an easier way to make lightbulbs explode.

Sadly, the comments are more interesting than the article. I too would like to hear what drashek has too say.

the real db is...
imo, the LED supporter

CFL#s!, Down with that sort of thing!!

the wiki quoter is defo full o shit, no right minded individual would quote the wiki on the inq as expect to get anything other than ridiculed, even years after the everywhere girl was killed by psuedo penis creating monsters.

db here for years and never quoted on wiki,
drashek, where are you when we need you? it madness here
sort this mess out

LMAO

Fight, fight, fight!

We are back in the playground and the teachers are starting to look out of the staff room window. Get the fight started before some of the teachers come over and break it up!

What was the article about?

Do LED's get dimmer over time?

I tried swapping an LED for a light bulb and it went bang, but while it worked it wasn't as bright as the light bulb. (winding up the winder)

Sharp is doing a great thing. I just hope that the prices comes down on these things.

Here is another interesting link to it.

http://it-chuiko.com/gadgets/2014-ces-2010-new-tvs-from-sharp-with-rgby-range-and.html

You know db you got a lot of good points (the original one). I'm glad I am not caught in the middle of this.

You really have some nerve. You are so arrogant it's disgusting. Mind you if you are an engineer it's explains your arrogance.

You know your a stupid arse hole by defaming my name. You know that right!

Sorry guys I was reading too that LEDs use current limiting circuits which will have capacitors. From reading Wikipedia and in layman's terms they says these capacitors are required to smooth out ac voltage into DC voltage. It's more complicated then that but just in general terms.

They say that dielectric material inside the capacitor will dry out which will push the current limiting circuit out of specification. That will occur well before the 50 000 hours. So I guess that will limit the LEDs lifespan because bulbs are sold as a single unit.

I was also looking at Wikipedia, they talk about something called L75 and L50. Apparently LEDs do dim who knew? not me. I guess I was wrong. It's a good thing I checked Wikipedia. I wouldn't want to make a fool of myself. I haven't done much research on this. It's not like a billion dollar retailer has contracted me to do a cost analysis for their stores. I also don't have a PhD Degree in Electrical engineering at university of Waterloo. At least I have Wikipedia.

@db(the real one)

Real LEDs do degrade over time, as Fritzr stated their MTBF is based around a 30% reduction in light output. Where I work we build flight displays (military, commercial, private applications). Our displays utilized LED backlight technology, and part of the backlight design is a sensor for measuring light output. As the output degrades the LEDs are driven harder to compensate for the reduced LED output over the life of the display.

Also, in regards to reliability the MTBF numbers are typically quoted for a single bulb. So unless you can replace a single CFL with a single LED that is a bit misleading. Typically, as the number of LEDs increase the total reliability for the LED array will decrease so it misleading to quote MTBF numbers for a single LED. In some of our applications we have thousands of LEDs in an array. Also, due to chromaticity requirements we cannot always get away with just white LEDs. The colored LEDs tend to have reduced performance with respect to the white LEDs. Although I do not know if the same issue applies to commercial TVs.

Finally, in regards to thermal issues only being a matter of proper circuit design, that is BS. Real designs have numerous constraints and cannot be optimized around a single aspect. In the real world LEDs get hot, and they need different cooling solutions then those that are used for incandescent or fluorescent light sources.

This is a good overview of lighting technology specifically to electronics (no rocket science required). It is over 3 years out of date but I think it is still relevant to this conversation:
http://electronics-cooling.com/articles/2006/2006_nov_a3.php

Still with all that said I believe that LED is the future of lighting, but it is not without it’s specific challenges.

@Fritzr

Thanks for the info but from the many searches I have made there is very inconclusive results. I'm just quoting the rocket scientist I had as a teacher in my electronics engineering technologist diplomas. BTW when I say rocket scientist I mean he actually worked for NASA on jet propulsion systems. I would trust his opinion more then the many hacks online who make claims without any science, math or formulas for this.

One thing though seems to popup often is the quality of the plastics used in the encapsulating lense that holds the semiconductor and temperature fluctuations.

Also I found some manufacturers who even claim of having white LED's that have a MTBF of 300000 (roughly 34 years of constant use).

I will admit that the teacher may have been making claims about semiconductors lasting longer then a human life span when dealing with military grade quality/design and not the inferior commercial grade or the even more inferior consumer grade semiconductor quality/design.

I personally have never had any device long enough to know if an LED would dim over time but I will say that the information is extremely vague at best. DLP TVs are a full circuit board with much more going on then just the light also being encased in a chassis that probably has very little airflow I would say that heat is the problem there. LED bulbs are out in the open but still encased in the bulb which may hold heat being generated by the LED. FYI LED's should if driven properly not produce any noticeable heat but if these LED bulbs do then they are over driving it which would greatly reduce the lifespan of any semiconductor, just ask any extreme overclocker and they will give you an ear full. Semiconductors are sensitive to thermal stress which can change the electrical characteristics of the device over time and this would definitely affect the lifespan.

Occam's Razor would suggest that plastic quality seems to be the more sensible answer then many others.

Thanks Fritzr this has been an interesting and insightful discussion with you. BTW I would not trust NY times for my science questions I would go to a physics dedicated site such as physorg.com or universities forums for this. Remember a business is in business to make money and there is no money in making something that lasts for ever.

PS to SV Guy yeah the second and eighth post are the ass clown trying to be an idiot otherwise I would just be a schizophrenic arguing with himself :D. I have been using this handle here for about 5 to 7 years now.

link to full article: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/02/11/how-long-did-you-say-that-bulb-will-last/

quote from linked article
<quote
When a manufacturer says that an LED lamp will last 25,000 or 50,000 hours, what the company actually means is that at that point, the light emanating from that product will be at 70 percent the level it was when new.

Why 70 percent? Turns out, it’s fairly arbitrary. Lighting industry engineers believe that at that point, most people can sense that the brightness isn’t what it was when the product was new. So they decided to make that the standard.

Of course, brightness is subject to the old frog in the boiling water syndrome. I’m sure that most people won’t even notice the lower level then, if they’ve lived with the same bulb for its entire life. (How many owners of rear projection DLP TVs only realize that a TV’s image has dimmed once they replace the bulb?)

If nothing else in the lamp fails, like its electronics, the product will continue to work until it becomes really dim. But some engineers are proposing a way to get around even that.
</quote

Hopefully by now he's gone back and re-read the article and noticed that it had nothing to do with the comparison between LED and CFL.

Obviously your trying to point out your intelectual superiority but according to "again" a little googling I found this nice little link/quote:

"ANSI lumens
The light output of projectors (including video projectors) is typically measured in lumens. A standardized procedure for testing projectors has been established by the American National Standards Institute, which involves averaging together several measurements taken at different positions.[3] For marketing purposes, the luminous flux of projectors that have been tested according to this procedure may be quoted in "ANSI lumens", to distinguish them from those tested by other methods. ANSI lumen measurements are in general more accurate than the other measurement techniques used in the projector industry.[4] This allows projectors to be more easily compared on the basis of their brightness specifications.[5]
"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumen_(unit)

You know your a stupid arse hole by defaming my name and yes CFL's do lose their brightness over time:

1) http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1229062/Energy-saving-lightbulbs-dimmer-time.html

2) http://kn.theiet.org/news/nov09/energy-saving-bulbs.cfm

3)http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Energy+saving+lightbulbs+become+dimmer+over+time.(News)-a0212362900

4) just do the google search I did
"cfl lose brightness"

If you would read a little more and talk a little less you would already know this. LED's do not loose any brightness at all the just stop work when they die kinda like incandescent bulbs. Here is a little test you can do to show you what happens... buy an LED (or grab an old PC case and rip one out) give it a higher then the rated input voltage (if your ripping one out of the pc case then give it more then 5V DC) and you will see it will work for a little bit and then go out.

I wrote this nice rebuttal to your comment in the end I deleted it. When I saw you based your information just on sharps website, and how your information is inaccurate such as "lumens degrade over time where LED does not".

Honestly you have no clue and there is no point in continuing this. Sorry.

Pascal, its true, RGB covers only a fraction of the visible gamut. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:CIExy1931_sRGB_gamut.png

At the time RGB was "invented" it was a revolutionary upgrade from monochrome displays, but we are definitely long overdue for a next upgrade. I don't see any details about their solution but I welcome any news that pertains to advent of technology that will cover an entire visible spectrum, we will all benefit from that, starting with more vibrant and realistic greens and reds. It will probably encode into 64 or 128 bits per pixel or more to accomodate all the shades but it will take some time for the technology to become a standard and enter our homes as mainstream. Regardless, you have to start from somewhere and having a format and a display that uses it is a GREAT start.

BTW when it comes to lumens that is per LED but if a bulb is made up of more then one LED then you will get brighter lumens then CFL.

An other interesting thing I read in the link above is:

"These LED lamps emit almost no light in the 350-nm (ultraviolet) waveband that tends to attract insects, thus minimizing dirt and contamination of the lighting fixture from flying bugs and insects."

Imagine not having to clean your light fixture because it is filled with bugs.

The time frames above are if you have the bulb on 24x7 365 days a year. According to Sharp for an average of 10 hours of use every day the bulbs should las 10 years.

http://sharp-world.com/corporate/news/090611_2.html

I agree when fluorescent are new your are technically right but the reality is that the lumens degrade over time where LED does not.

This is the kind of hokey pokey BS that so many led to believe is reality. A few months of use will show this. Just because there is light coming out of them does not make them bright and as I mentioned if LED's are made right they will shine at full brightness for longer then a human lives. Please explain how LED's can save you even more then CFL's.

Here is a few interesting tidbits

"CFLs typically have a rated lifespan of between 6,000 and 15,000 hours"

"LEDs providing over 150 lm/W have been demonstrated in laboratory tests,[29] and expected lifetimes of around 50,000 hours are typical."

"General Electric in 2007 announced a high-efficiency incandescent bulb, which was said to ultimately produce the same lumens per watt as fluorescent lamps"

So if you choose to use a bulb that only lasts a max of 2 years and being made from highly toxic materials which requires special disposal and creates more garbage compared to a bulb that lasts 6 years made from much less toxic materials that is up to you. I'm all for LED's also sharp managed to get their LED's to produce 560 lumens which is very good and at 7.5 watts for the brighter model this does still save half of what most people buy as CFL's (15W). This will save you money in the long run.

Really ? Darn, and here I thought I've been seeing proper colors since the VGA days of last millenium.

Hey db could do you me a favor? Go look at fluorescent bulbs Lumens per watt then compare it to leds. I think you will be surprised.

When you hear those the sky is falling, cough,cough, the world is warming people saying to use compact florescence bulbs saying it will save the world and your wallet are totally stupid. I've been waiting for the white LED to make it to market for years.

When you generally get better lumen's per watt with LED's than almost anything else out there it makes no sense to use florescence bulbs at all. Also generally semiconductors if designed correctly should out live a human that is also an other incentive. I'm sure the only reason why LED lighting has take so long is that it has taken manufacturers several years to build an LED that dies quickly so that a market can be financially beneficial.