Politics is more dangerous than war, for in war you are only killed once - Winston Churchill
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Autistic hacker loses another appeal
THE UK'S PUBLIC PROSECUTOR has decided it cannot interrupt Gary McKinnon's extradition to face hacking charges in the US because the US hasn't given them enough evidence. Gary has been caught by a Catch-22 in which the US is allowed to demand his extradition without supplying evidence, but the UK cannot challenge the extradition unless it has the evidence.
The Crown Prosecution Service had agreed to have another look at Gary's extradition after it was given a full confession of crimes under the UK's Computer Misuse Act and medical proof of the hacker's recently diagnosed Asperger's Syndrome. If the CPS agreed to prosecute Gary in the UK, it would nullify the extradition order; and he would stand trial and serve any sentence in the UK, in an environment less likely to aggravate his autistic condition.
Delivering the results of its deliberations today, the CPS said it could not accept Gary's confessions under the Computer Misuse Act because the evidence available to them in the UK did not "come near to reflecting the criminality that is alleged by the American authorities". The US doesn't have to supply evidence for an extradition under its treaty with the UK. It would therefore be left to the Americans to prove the greater charges in a US court.
The CPS was also given compelling medical evidence to suggest that it would be illegally cruel to send someone with Asperger's Syndrome through the ordeal of extradition and a foreign jail sentence. But the prosecutor didn't even consider the matter. It couldn't it said, because it didn't have the US evidence.
It could only consider an Asperger's diagnosis under a public interest test, but its hands were tied: "All cases must first pass an evidential test and then the public interest test only if that test is satisfied. Because this stage was not reached, the public interest test did not therefore arrive."
Karen Todner, Gary's solicitor, said in a statement that she was disappointed that the Director of Public Prosecutions had not simply asked the US to supply the evidence. "This is a matter which we will consider further," she said.
The CPS also reconsidered in which legal jurisdiction a trans-Atlantic hacker should be tried. And they decided that as the bulk of evidence and witnesses were in the US, that's where the trial should happen.
"I'm heartbroken at the lack of compassion shown towards my desperately vulnerable son," Janis Sharp, Gary's Mum, said in a statement.
"When will the UK stop hiding behind treaty obligations to the US and let humanity, common sense and decency prevail? We've suffered an agonising seven years which has ruined the lives and health of my family. Somebody somewhere please wake up - and realise the extradition of even one vulnerable person cannot be a price worth paying to save the US government's embarrassment," she said.
Gary is still awaiting the outcome of a judicial review into the question of whether his Asperger's Syndrome should prevent his extradition. It is due to report its decision in March. µ
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My knowledge of the UK extradition agreement with the US is limited to what is said in this article but, WOW. What a terrible agreement for UK citizens. Who was responsible for that? The US has greater power over UK citizens that the UK does? The UK needs to renegotiate that agreement. What an embarrassment.
A decision on Gary McKinnon could hopefully be delayed until this is sorted out and evidence is obtained. He may end up being extradited anyway but at least it would be fair.
Hopefully the U.S. will prosecute McKinnon like any other scumbum hacker and throw him in prison where he belongs. It makes no matter if he has Arsewipe Syndrome or not, he'll fit just fine in a U.S. prison cell.
Another intelligent comment from our American friends!
It amazes me how you guys do it.
America will be lucky to find itself in 5th place when this depression is over. The UK needs to review who its' government sells out to.
And if it was up to our friends in Europe we'd let the hackers and anyone else who brakes the law go free. Just like someone who knows braking into someones home is wrong, but does it repeatedly. It works the same way with infiltrating US government servers. What if the situation was reversed, I had the sudden urge to probe the government computers of The UK to find out who really killed Princess Diana and I had a medical condition? So, all of a sudden I get caught, and the authorities in the UK want me for trial since I have gained access to confidential information . I'd still be prosecuted even though I knew what I was doing was wrong...
Its amusing to see how intelligent (I mean childish) some of you people really are when trashing Americans.
I love that you want to support this guy. If it were a yank that did this to the MOD would you be so energetic in your defense of the yank? Or would you want to hang him or her at the Tower?
Phil, why do you think Ollie is American? I assume you are not American based on your post, but I can not identify your nationality. Making assumptions like Ollie's nationality because you don't like what he has to say, while insulting someone else's intelligence, really doesn't make you look all that intelligent. It makes you look like someone who wants to pick a fight with an American, any American, and you're just hoping you found one. I could say that you must be a stupid frog, but that would make me look ignorant. Ollie may be South African, as far as you know. Get the point?
And yeah, America's time in the sun may be ending. There have been 'superpowers' for thousand of years before anyone thought up that word, and they have all passed into history. I pray we get hit hard and revert to agrigarian isolationism; we spend too much (lives, cash, time) fighting for the right to fight. Have fun in the future: next time around will Britain bow to China, or will it be the Middle East?
With those senarios there would be not a hope in hell of you being extradited to the UK!!! that's the whole point . We know who really killed Diana just as we Know who really did 911
Why not try him here in the US and sentence him here, if found guilty, but let him serve his sentence close to mommy in the UK.
Not sure why I say try him here though because he is already proven guilty by his own admission, but anyway...
As someone who has been to federal prison here in the US for 21 months. I know for a fact that he will not be in that bad of a place. Hackers and other types like him end up whats called a federal prison camp. There not hard core places like people think. They don't even have fence around them and have all you can eat at most of them. Not some place I feel like going back to but I can't really say it was a bad place. Just so you guys know I was in there for 7 counts of mail fraud for steeling money over the internet using Amazon
Yet another wonderful instance of lawyers and solicitors following their books and their precedents to serve their wallets but fail everybody else around them. How did we legislate ourselves into their servitude.
Oh...d'oh!
That's nothing, I did 18 years hard time in a federal pen. I stole $125 million from eBay / Paypal from overseas in Nepal, but living the high life I visited New Yoak for a spending spree, got busted. That was back in 1983. Since then Paypal corrected their system & it's now much harder to steal money from eBay / Paypal.
Anyway, he should have it easy & don't forget to get yourself a free University degree, I chose psychology. Now I'm a nut case! Yuk, yuk; I crack me up!
That's nothing, I did 18 years hard time in a federal pen. I stole $125 million from eBay / Paypal from overseas in Nepal, but living the high life I visited New Yoak for a spending spree, got busted. That was back in 1983. Since then Paypal corrected their system & it's now much harder to steal money from eBay / Paypal.
Anyway, he should have it easy & don't forget to get yourself a free University degree, I chose psychology. Now I'm a nut case! Yuk, yuk; I crack me up!
found an interesting comment from the US Embassy on extradition between US and UK.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/letters/article5541880.ece
I don't konw if it's accurate, but it's interesting. Also interesting to read the Wikipedia article on him.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_McKinnon
What a nice note he left for us on military computers. Doesn't seem related to UFO's....
Message left for US government was: "US foreign policy is akin to government-sponsored terrorism these days... It was not a mistake that there was a huge security stand-down on September 11 last year... I am SOLO. I will continue to disrupt at the highest levels".
Seems like UFO hunt to me. I for one hope he is found guilty and has to do the full sentence. It's a pitty he might end up in one the federal prisons that offer more to the prisoners than the average human enjoys.
These hackers can go to hell, and I hope there are more extraditions so these little shits know they can't just hide behind some other country's borders to avoid punishment. "Assburger" excuse or not, these kids need to be shown *what is up* if you're messing around with the wrong people for "fun" or "attention." I'm sure this is giving UK "hackers" a lot to think about, and I could only wish the same thing would happen to American hackers as well, though they'd probably end up in some cushy "prison" when sent to Europe.
I wonder how aware President Obama is of this case. If I were Janis Sharp, Gary's mother, I would write Michelle Obama.
Seriously, whats with all those hacker hate comments?!?
Hey assholes, he didn't cause any damage -- he has just shown that your government has been spending your taxpayer money on insecure systems, and on people who were supposed to keep those systems secure but failed due to their sheer incompetence.
So instead of being mad at your own government for wasting taxpayer's money while giving you the false sense of security you are mad at Gary?!?
It just shows how stupid you all are!
I would give him a medal instead, and put in jail everyone responsible in chosing, ordering, deploying, and maintaining of those systems that got hacked.
But no, it is always better to convince people to fight against an outside enemy. I guess you never read the book "1984"? D'oh!
By the way, I bet that many of you hacker haters use pirated software. Guess who hacks it for you? Morons.
Justice is not served when the U.K government signs a one sided extradition treaty to allow America to extradite any U.K citizen without having to provide any evidence but we in the U.K have to provide probable cause / actual evidence if we want to extradite an American and even when we provide evidence America refuses to extradite it's criminals and murderers whether they are soldiers or IRA terrorists backed by American money.
Gary has always denied the alleged damage but has not been allowed to contest it in a court of law.
97% of cases never get to trial in America, they leave people locked up often for years until they agree to a Plea Bargain, even when they are innocent. Happens all the time.
You need to be rich to get a fair trial and decent legal representation in America.
They left Kevin Mitnick locked up for years until he accepted a plea bargain.
Gary's mother should be proud of herself for fighting so hard for her son who should not be extradited.
I believe that many of the comments on here are by people that are on the payroll of the US government.
They stand out a mile.
This war is not over yet, there's a Judicial Review and I'm sure a few other legal moves are planned but the Magna Carta should do it as this is common law that overides statutes and is what will defeat this one sided treaty in the end.
The Gary McKinnon case will defeat this one sided treaty for sure as Brits are angry about the injustice.
If one guy could bring down the U.S military by usig a dial up computer in his bedroom seven years ago; then the U.S miitary were in a sad and sorry state and should be grateful to McKinnon.
He apparently believed it was no accident that there was a stand down after 9/11, because he believed as does half the world, that 9/11 was an inside job and that the U.S was guilty of state sponsored terrorism.
The disruption he used were desperate notes left on U.S computers to try and wake them up to their total lack of security.
Perhaps U.S military traitors did cause 9/11 and deliberately left thousands of military computers with no passwords and no firewalls. Otherwise why would they be so damn stupid.
I think the American people would like to know this, rather than trying to shoot the messenger.
Searching for info on UFO's does not preven that same person from leaving cyber grafitti, any idiot knows that.
but I'd still like to spit in the face of all you hacker-hater comment posters. You fuckheads should put your passion for payback where it would be better served, like charging the bush admin for war crimes. rot.
Does any of you gung ho americans remember Kevin Mitnick at all?
You ruined his life good for -what exactly? Oh that's right: NOTHING!
trolling trolls trolling trolls.
Seriously though this has NOTHING to do with some autistic hacker and EVERYTHING to do about uk.gov taking it up the backside from their oh so friendly allies.
The sooner we turf this gov out the better! Not that the next will be much better no doubt. But if you leave them in power for too long this carp happens.
Policy, politics and his mother's rhetoric aside... given the "evidence" and the fact there is a confession supporting the evidence seems like an open and shut case. He cannot go unpunished which is exactly the fear, and it sets a very terrible precedent that basically undermines the whole criminal justice system in UK and the US. I really don't care if he gets at least 5-10 years for his stupidity where he goes (UK or US) but he should not get to profit from his crime either. Let alone have the ability to repeat the same crime and use the same defenses to weasel out of getting caught. Heck, I find it ironic that it is easier for the RIAA to prosecute than it is for the US government!
trolls indeed, but it's not us.
"97% of cases never get to trial in America, " Seriously... !@?@?!?!?!!!!?
What part of "I am SOLO. I will continue to disrupt at the highest levels" doesn't equal damage? With your logic I should thank Osama for showing us our vunerabilities. Will you give me a medal for hitting you with a baseball bat for showing you your vunerability? Next time I'm in a car crash, I'll get out and thank the guy.
I highly value real security researchers, this guy is simply one of the bad guys.
I wouldn't expect anything less of the UK to hand over one of it's citizens on a technicality.
On the other hand, if it was protecting the rights of an outsider who had moved here, the UK would probably go as far as launch a nuclear attack.
The sooner this crappy little Island gets invaded and put in it's rightful place by the EU, the better for everyone living here.
So basically, if I decide to look for Di's killer in every computer in the UK and I happen to crash computers on the way during my "glorious search for truth," it's OK because I say I have good intentions? I'm sure you wouldn't feel that way if it directly affected your daily life.
br
Computer damages are really hard to prove in any country by the way. Look at any major virus or worm damages for example. If anything, those are underestimations usually. Guess what, those guys hardly get prosecuted too. Notice a trend? Increase in severe level viruses, worms, and rootkits anyone. Even companies like Sony are using rootkits. Let's face it, just like the hippie revolution, the hacker revolution has sold out. Crime does pay apparently. Why did I even bother getting a legitimate job or going to school to get educated?
http://speakup-europe.blogactiv.eu/2008/04/17/creation-of-a-european-service-for-the-study-of-ufos
Stil not allowed?
I don't give a rats what mental dissorder that this twit has.
He did the crime, he's been caught, he should do the time.
He had enough smarts to break into the system, so he has enough smarts to know that he shouldn't have.
Hopefully, they make an example of him and throw away the key.
I'm not saying there is a correlation between the two behaviors, but I will say there is a correlation between the two legal defenses.
http://tech.yahoo.com/news/ap/20090401/ap_on_hi_te/craigslist_slaying
Apparently, in the rest of the world, harming people is OK as long as it is against Americans:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/03/27/60minutes/main4897053.shtml
Lesson of the day: If you don't like someone, don't allow any fairness in interactions between you and them.
Just remember, that goes both ways.