While I write this on my lowly netbook (that Intel says makes not enough money for them) my wife's HP notebook is back to a loud fan that I can hear over the TV some 20-30 feet away. And yes it already has had the board replaced once. Just tonight it had lines on screen and almost didn't boot up. HP notebook please die again soon so I can call Costco again. I wish this time they take it back and set me up with a Acer netbook that is less than half the cost of this junker. I'm probably dreaming though. NVIDIA thanks for robbing me, I'll remember you.

As a american poster, and a new one, I wanted to take the time to point out, I had a nice Dell 1705, never thought about these posts, until now, I sold it on ebay went to rewrite windows, and wouldn't you know it, bamm, my Navidia 7900 card, is fried, that was bad enough, but what is worse, is sending a note to Dell, saying how could you change a battery but leave us with bad vid cards, you can read all the blogs, and post saying dell laptop Nvidia cards are bad, he not only won't talk to me, he yelled at me in the email you don't know what your talkin about we don't have a problem like that, sure, sure, the sellers of vid cards on ebay is not real there sir.....very sad, they should just admit to there trouble, I am now worried about my SLI Nvidia, in my desktop it cost $150 and I bet its gonna go bad too, so sad, they will lose me as a customer, and I build systems, they are shooting there own foot, I will get my customers to sell there boards, all cause a company is acting like this. I wish I could get some help, the thousand dollar laptop is now just a parts machine, nice going Nvidia, Thx for listening, I am from Washington state, we do have some snow we will send ya, got 61 inches in Dec. Happy new year to all, and our friends over the ocean!

Aren't Charlie's findings and Nvidia statements on the 9400 compatible?

Charlie's findings are that high-lead bumps combined with the former non-Hitachi underfill cause defective chips (or at least plain unacceptable failure rate under power cycling); and that at least some 9400 use high-lead bumps.

Nvidia statement is that the 9400 "use the new material set" and is not defective.

This would be plain compatible if the 9400 used the new, better Hitachi underfill, and it was good enough to prevent problems even with the high-lead bumps. I see no indication to the contrary.

So why so much fuss and FUD? Ain't it time for peace on earth on that matter at least?

Disclaimer: This is NOT an endorsement of Nvidia's denial attitude on the issue. And I'm an electrical engineer with no expertise in semiconductor packaging.

Well, we all knew it was true, and this is just the icing on the cake.

For Nvidia to actually admit it did something wrong (*gasp*) is a major milestone in itself.

But this is in someway like the captain of the Titanic denying they had hit an iceberg right up to the point where the flag at the stern sinks under the waves and then saying, "aahh, errm yes well we did actually hit an iceberg - sorry about that"

It was evident all along, Nvidia denying it just exposed what those on the inside already knew: That they are a bunch of lying, foolish, stupid arrogant ****suckers.

What is even more amusing is people on here saying "I will still buy Nvidia".

aaah well like vendor, like customer...

I am sick and tire of Nvidia video card especially not been open and do the right thing. They should have recall all the defective chips/video card. I will not buy any Nvidia product ever again.

From the Apple knowledgebase article:

"Before visiting the Genius Bar at the Apple Retail Store, please make a reservation."

I think I just threw up in my mouth a little bit.

Chalk up one skeptic finally convinced. Charlie stuck to this like a remora, and it finally paid off. The electron microscope is mightier than the sword!

All in all, however... don't you think you could tone down the gloating, Charlie? I would think that the facts getting out would be vitriolic enough to Nvidia, but the language you use just seems sort of unprofessional. I just think a little more tact would make your writing as professional as your investigation.

Note how nVidia in its note to their partners doesnt admit to having problems.

They call the move to the new chipset "the current end stage of life cycle".

So they're basically saying there's a newer version and the existing one is phased out. They again manage to spin themselves out of the public mess that they have managed to avoid sofar.

I think Charlie displayed some pretty good journalism on this one and THANKS!

Sure one chip and a supposed e-mail reply proves nothing but that is besides the point? This is Nvidia coming out and admitting to what Charlie detailed?

I must admit I don't trust most of what I read on the INQ but instead of attacking Charlie or INQ, why not do some critical thinking or simply stop reading INQ? I hope there aren't any people who just read INQ for their "news"...;-)

As for the Nvidia bashing, so far for the past ~3 years, I personally think INQ is opportunistic and will bash anyone if they can get enough dirt.

Nvidia is not the only bunch of corporate scumbags out there.

How about an article on how ATI is deliberately breaking cards with driver updates. I had a whole slew of new games crash to desktop on my x850xl(mass effect, fallout 3, etc, etc). Then I switched to third party Omega drivers and everything I throw at the card runs fine. I was going to buy a new card for Christmas, thinking it was end of life. But as we are learning corporate malfeasance knows no bounds.

That is a pretty scummy way to get new business, *deliberately* breaking you kit. At least nvidia was just covering up a mistake a la gigabyte capacitor

But Charlie, what on earth are you going to write about now? for the last 6 months you have basically earned a living on negative nvidia articles!

I will be glad its over because it has been a monumental bore and im stunned that everyone seemingly reading these expects Nvidia to come out into the open and admit they messed up and offer everyone compensation. Clearly quite a few niave readers!

"NB8E-SE is used on many notebooks most commonly advertised as GeForce 8700M GT, GeForce 8800M GS or GeForce 9650M GS"

So I guess 3 products means all are bad these days? Do you know how many products Nvidia has out there currently? I've seen far worse recalls and this isn't even a recall, just a product switch. Of course it's terrible some people are going to get a bad product, but name ONE company that hasn't had product problems. ATI? AMD? Intel? You're kidding right? All have had problems. It's INEVITABLE. If you make enough products eventually you'll make a bad batch etc. It's just life. Get over it. FYI, my whole family loves their 8800GTOC's. We also have an 8600GTOC in the family. No problems. Note they are replacing all our ATI's...LOL. A radeon 9800Pro, and two 9700Pro's and a 9600Pro. Which two of those had failures and were RMA'd over their life. So it happens. Big deal.

It turns out that you were right. After all, it came from another website, VR-Zone.com, with an actual quote from Nvidia itself. Now, you are known by your fruits of hard work, of bringing it to light. If it were not for you, Nvidia could probably have gotten away with this whole chip fiasco for at least 6-12 more months, while we ignorant ones keep on buying Nvidia's 65nm chips that have an average of 1-year lifespan.

Thank you so much, Charlie, for being man enough to bring it to attention despite being flamed by all those juvenile-minded sissies. You're the tech hero of the year, helping millions of would-be Nvidia customers by putting the pressure on Nvidia to do the right thing. I've always loved the INQ, and am looking forward to its reputation being redeemed by this very thing.

I have no vested interest in either nVidia or ATI or Intel graphics. My needs are strictly 2d accel.

I have helped 2 people with these failed chips now. In both cases, their laptop motherboards need replacement. One has been completed and one is being arranged for.

In both cases, these laptops are only about 1 year old. Thank goodness for the extended 2 yr warrantee for this which Dell, Apple and HP have implemented.

My ability to perform tech support for these problem laptops is a direct result of Charlie's reporting. Having dealt with the problems first hand, I see nothing in Charlie's reporting which is untruthful or biased. Charlie wrote up the issues exactly like they are.

Personally, I run a Dell Inspiron 7500 built in Oct 2001 with ... wait for it ... an optional nVidia graphics chip I've been very happy with {high end version with 1600x1200 120dpi display}.

It's obvious to me that, in nVidia's quest to corner marketshare, nVidia made a bunch of stupid decisions to cut corners and speed production times. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

Between the lies and driver tweaking to fudge graphic testing results, changing it's method of calculating TPW {to apparently have the same number of TPW but a hotter part - which implies more real power}, to telling everyone that it's OK to run hotter, to all the physical shortcuts involved in this fisaco - nVidia has made a host of continuing stupid decisions.

Thank you Charlie for your timely reporting.

As for you fanbois, my personal experience and observations regarding the problems I've been forced to deal with regarding these very chips has resulting in my blanket recommendation to everyone who asks to NOT buy anything with nVidia graphic chips in it. The aggravation is not worth it.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that nVidia has, for whatever reason, done some really stupid things here. Even my non-tech friends understand that after I walk them through the process of getting their motherboards replaced under their respective special extended 2 yr warrantees.

Once again Charlie, thank you.

The truth is out there!

under nVidias chair.

Looks like Apple are none too chuffed and are hurriedly calling kettle black and pointing fingers in an outraged manner. Really she doth protest too much.

It's not just nV & Apple though, rich fare though that is, its all their partners using the 86 to 92s. I expect they would all prefer it was brushed under the carpet and never reached the light of day.

But Charlie is not just the consumers friend, he is nVidia's friend too believe it or not, since companies fail in the long term when they can not get the feedback they need on their product due to internal politics and power games.

It takes a real journalist to open the can of worms and make those responsible face up to the fiasco rather than repeat the errors that lead to disaster enough times for the company to fold. Freedom of the press and all that...

Hurray Charlie you did it again..

I hope this time you dont have to wear a bunny suit... for CEBIT possibly.

... why don't all the fanboys and holier-than-thou-ists just take a seat over there for a second. You know what you're doing is wrong don't you? Attacking journalists who report problems because they exist, and lose respect for a company when they don't admit it? You're essentially saying that you would rather not have these problems be reported, and are fine with companies just covering it up. Good for you, now stay away from any news sources, or at least, any that don't share the exact same views as you, would you kindly? It would be greatly appreciated if you would separate yourselves from society entirely, as stubborn, closed-minded people like yourselves are not needed, nor wanted.

As said before: GOOD JOB SIR. Keep 'em coming.

See, what's really pathetic is this thinly veiled, ongoing prosecution of Nvidia based on supposition and flawed logic. So an analysis of ONE chip by an electron microscope proves what? That a point can nearly be proven by the analysis of one chip that who know what it was subjected to? I don't think so. The conclusion doesn't nearly support the claim. To the casual observer, it might look like I'm defending Nvidia, but that's not the case. I'm questioning the claims made by someone who thinks they are qualified to prove intentional misconduct by using guesswork and misleading logic combined with rhetoric. For all I know, these claims might really be true, or close to the truth. But supporting them with the pathetic excuse of objectivity shown here is a travesty. Add that to the piss-poor editing and grammar used and you have zero credibility. Calling Charlie a journalist is an insult to anyone who takes that occupation seriously. Oh, by the way, I have 4 of the chips that are supposedly "flawed" and they have absolutely no problems.

after all this slaging out on NV I still dont know what models are effected.

please supply model no. and revision no.
of the affected products please

I've gone through two Quadro cards on my shiny Dell Precision Workstation at work. Tech support replaced the video card the first time. Second time they insisted on reformatting my computer. Now they will be back again with another video card. The problem that I'm having starts to show up in Acrobat and Google maps. Screen does not redraw in portrait mode after a little while. I think Dell is recycling these bad cards into a pool of replacement cards. Ie. swap a bad video card for another bad video card. Frustrating for the consumer!

"Whee, look! The shreds of the company's credibility are twitching!"
and while charlie is chipping away at nvidia's credibility, he's taken a chainsaw (called horribly slanted reporting) to his own credibility. really charlie, are you using the "fox news: fair and balanced" style of jounalism? i'm all for keeping corporations honost, but i can never take your articles seriously because of the spin.

"it is not just confined to the old MacBooks, but the desktops as well"
is there another scandle going on here? every report i've read confines this problem to the laptop models, taking any chance you can to get a low blow?

there is one qustion that has been eating at the back of my brain: if charlie is such an awesome engineer, why doesn't he work for ati? or maybe he does and that's why EVERY article he writes is full of spin against nvidia....

(written by a pround 4850, 4870 and 9800gx2 owner)

Merry Christmas Charlie!
GZ

Charlie deserves a christmas bonus for all this. I don't understand why the fanbois keep swearing by their asses that "my Nvidia still runs after 11 months!" Fanboi, you'd better hope it fails soon so you can still return it for warranty replacement.

Now, I admit I am Pro-AMD/ATI, but I'd hate to see Nvidia fail. I've had some good Nvidia cards over the years. One mistake doesn't mean we should all beat Nvidia to death, does it? Give them a break.

Besides, if they die you can bet your ass Intel will snap up 90% of the engineers for their Larrabee project and this will only mean the mighty and evil Intel empire will just grow even more.

bottom line: it takes some courage to be a public journalist using ones real name in the first place especially with the mob mentality etc that is pervasive online. To then go live with 'news' not just nvidia news but any story which may lead to career risk /ridicule etc is balls.

Contrast the ballsy online journalist to the whiny pontificating cowardly masses that post drivel on websites. makes ya wanna slap em all upside the head with a clue stick

It seems this may be the last nail in the coffin - even the fanboys gave up commenting. Great work Charlie! Keep on digging!

Nice one Charlie, that was the way it's meant to be played!

Good job Charlie. My hat off to you.

Where are these loud, obnoxious and rude people who have been calling Charlie names ? They must have been just a bunch of juvenile fanbois.

Happy Xmass, Boxing Day and a New Year !

Cheers over a virtual beer :)

Charlie has been nothing short of professional. Hats off. The Inq. exposed that other cover up (broken VPU on NV40) a few years back with less sucessful results. That did not affect nearly as many people as this has. Keep their feet to the fire.

Sure nVidia f**ked up, and it pisses me off they didn't just come out with it and tell everyone when they found out their mistake - but I'll still be buying their cards and chipsets after this.

IBM made a grand screwup with their Desktar, yet people still buy Hitachi hard drives

AMD Phenom II 920 & 940 Review:

http://www.hwbox.gr/showthread.php?t=3189

You're dreaming... hard!

Also, I'd like to ask: what great games? You mean all those 'excellent' console ports that require a rocket of a computer to run in the first place, but even then they're nothing but a slideshow of pretty pictures because gameplay seems like an afterthought at best these days. I'm sure that nVidia's price policies in 2007 and the first half of 2008 brought a lot of interest to PC gaming, from both developers and gamers. Because buying a $200 graphics card just to run the latest slideshow at decent frame-rates and medium quality is a bargain... really, it is.

Mate, if these days you get to play the latest bloomfest at 1600x1200 or higher with $150 graphics cards it is as much ATI's merit as it is nVidia's.

As for the article, no surprise here. The truth was obvious for quite some time now. I commend Charlie for what he did, it's perfectly normal that such shady business practices get pulled out into the light. It seems there are so few of us who find this normal though. Most curious...

Aren't these the same chips that were built up in inventory as of the last conference call? And already put away $150M ish to replace them? The comment in that document even says..

" during the current “end stage” of life cycle"

Which sounds to me like they are suggesting them to not use the old ones that may have been built up in inventory already and move to these new ones ASAP.

Hockey Bob,
Mail me, use the link at the top of the article.

-Charlie

Utterly predictable, and sad.

Great job, Charlie! How's about a pint over at Brit's Pub in Mpls.? I'm buying!
(Greetings from Maplewood, MN!)

Finally they admit something. Life without nvidia would have been grand, free from defects, free from non original hardware (they copied 3dfx sli, as well as ati shader processor tech). free from low end card needing a power station to run them.

sadly, the probability that these foretold events were merely coincidental is far better than that of a dozen or so amino acids which somehow came into being - and together - to create conscious life out of nothin'... therefore L'inq's present feat is somewhat less impressive than watching evolutionary miracles happen.

Where would be? Hmmm, we'd probably be playing Half Life 2 at 1280x1024 and struggling to maintain frame rate. We'd be paying too much for Voodoo 6s, Rage 512s, Intel crap, and PowerVR whatevers. We definately wouldn't have as many great games and you probably wouldn't have such an awesome job.

Keep up the biased journalism, negativity makes this world go 'round.

Whats that I hear errrrr hmmmm owwww nothing where are the fanboys who denied this then I mean I own a 8600GT I hope it's not effected by this had it for 4 months non OCed and it's working fine so should be ok.

Thou I will be getting a ATi card soon because my new system is a Phenom 9550/780G set-up.

Excellent work Charlie. You should dedicate an article to the "haters". They could all stand to eat a little "crow."

What sucks though is that nvidia delayed this until after the holidays. Which I am sure was their plan. They got their holiday sales and Apple now gets to foot the repair bill for nvidia on a hell of a lot of holiday sales.

I'm sure nvidia will eventually be billed by Apple but nvidias holiday money is already in the bank accruing interest so the sting of this wont be that bad.

Well, it seems what comes around goes around, and nvidia's chicken's have come home to roost. Funny though that they release this statement during the holidays, when most people are to busy shopping, traveling, opening gifts and stuffing their face with xmas cheer!

Since these defective chips are still in the supply chain, and their is no way to tell a defective part from a good one, the the poor unsuspectful lot of sheople will continue to buy Nvidia's kit.

In a perfect world, Nvidia should do the right thing and recall all these parts, but it seems they feel they have said just enough to be able to sleep at night!

Hopefully OEM's such as Apple will sue the pants off Nvidia, but I suspect some under the table deal has already happened! If I had just bought a new MacBook pro, I would be demanding my money back..... any Nvidia card for that matter!

If ATI/AMD had done this same thing, do you really think world + dog would be taking this so quietly?

Good job. Been following this story #1. There was alot of stupid hatred (politics) pointed your way, so I'm sure it was not easy. Enjoy a beer.

Finally this bumpgate ends with Nvidia facing up to their faults.. dead on analysis Charlie!

Too bad they'll still be in business even after displaying such poor judgement and character.. pathetic indeed..